I've talked to the guy he is saying about the spliced videos

antman: i missed it... what happened?

at 06:56PM 07/07/08

ladybug: he shared about how people are taking his videos and splicing them and only giving part of the stories.
anyway, I've been texting a guy who totally believes that Todd is from the devil and mentioned these vidoes to me.

at 07:02PM 07/07/08

womanofgod: Too bad for everyone.

at 07:09PM 07/07/08

maryj: how do you guys watch this? is there a station he is on? i am interested in watching ;)

at 07:10PM 07/07/08

ladybug: we get direct TV. it carries God TV

at 07:15PM 07/07/08

ladybug: you can go online and watch God tV, or ignitedchurch.com or freshfire.ca

at 07:16PM 07/07/08

arealchange: is CNN there tonight?

at 07:16PM 07/07/08

ladybug: yes Sandi

at 07:16PM 07/07/08

arealchange: Yes there's alot of that nonsense going on.... there were picketers there when we were there with beware of false prophet signs

at 07:17PM 07/07/08

rachiebee: The sad part is that they are all being deceived anad will miss out on all the Lord is offering through this revival. We need to pray that the Lord changes their hearts!

at 07:21PM 07/07/08

manwaring: This is where something like this being nationally televised becomes counter productive. It definitely has its positives and negatives. If I was unsaved and turned on the tv and saw some of the stuff that goes on, I would be turned off the church. Of course I am a fan of the revival and I know it is real, but I absolutely see why people are so critical

at 07:21PM 07/07/08

ladybug: I think its christians who are having a hard time. Old line religious people. at least that what it looks like to me.

at 07:25PM 07/07/08

manwaring: well them and Heraldo

at 07:27PM 07/07/08

ladybug: yea

at 07:27PM 07/07/08

maryj: thanks for the info Beni! What channel I have direct as well

at 07:28PM 07/07/08

ladybug: I've seen them on here come off the streets into the meetings and get healed. share their healing and get saved right there. Very cool

at 07:28PM 07/07/08

ladybug: 365

at 07:29PM 07/07/08

aslan: @manwaring Good comment. You've made your point well. How we see, and experience, something can be quite different from how it's seen by someone else.

at 07:29PM 07/07/08

arealchange: I agree Beni, Jesus didn't do anything explaining as He went, He didn't do things so only those who understood would see.. it was always always the Sadduccee and Pharisee spirit that spouted at Him and it still is today :(

at 07:29PM 07/07/08

arealchange: This area in Lakeland has some interesting features... MASSIVE AMOUNTS of weeping willows...(The natural reveals something... I am studying to see what occured there 200 yrs ago to cause that) In regards to the picketers.... there are legalistic churches along Old 37 near the Sun and Fun... it was those people who came to picket

at 07:31PM 07/07/08

ladybug: met one of those people once. Wow! It was alarming what they believe.

at 07:32PM 07/07/08

arealchange: Want to be really alarmed I WAS ONE OF THOSE PEOPLE 20 years ago... no lie... no cut my hair, long dresses, no makeup, lose your salvation, sinless perfection, no literal hell, I could go on but won't.....He has delivered me from much... hence the reason I could sense it the minute I walked up that night

at 07:35PM 07/07/08

masongirl: I agree also that I have seen the most resistance from Christians. People I fellowship with. Change is not easy. Kris said something that was so good. It was something about seeing and hearing God for who He is. Not seeing and hearing Him based on our own experiences alone. You can't put God in a box.

at 07:40PM 07/07/08

maryj: thanks.. I can't believe I have had it all this time and never saw that channel.. how did I miss that?? lol

at 07:41PM 07/07/08

arealchange: I am gonna go on a limb here and this is not for you Masongirl... it is just in relation to what you said... God told me it isn't change that is hard..... it's LIFE that needs to come... there has been a strong delusion thru the religious community to the point that those who are His are seeing cloudy :( :(

at 07:41PM 07/07/08

manwaring: The picketers are definitely going to be christians, but I promise you, that a lot of non christians would be spooked by the stuff they see on tv

at 07:41PM 07/07/08

arealchange: Luke do you think the onlookers were spooked when Jesus did these kind of works? the unbelievers?

at 07:43PM 07/07/08

manwaring: A non christian sees a guy on tv get out of a wheel chair, they don't know if he was really paralyzed. In biblical times every knew everyone in their town because you just didn't travel, so when Jesus healed a person they saw it in person, and knew that it had to be real

at 07:47PM 07/07/08

30something: @manwaring-- You don't think Todd Bently should be seen by the world?

at 07:47PM 07/07/08

arealchange: well I guess media is part of GREATER works.. lol I agree with what you are saying and I see how God is using the internet. In the Bible people had arranged marriages, now they marry someone they have never met but know thru email! lol

at 07:48PM 07/07/08

masongirl: Sandi - No I hear what you are saying. I just understand that things that are different for certain people or not just different but unfamiliar can be hard.
I also understand Luke's point. We get comfortable and familiar with things. I took my grandparents to church on Sunday and viewing it from there perspective we sound like a bunch of nuts. Bethel is a revival culture that I love and they also really liked it but when you step outside and look at the things we do we sound and look like a bunch of weirdos. But heh nothing wrong with that. Jesus I'm sure looked the same. :)

at 07:50PM 07/07/08

manwaring: I am in two minds about it . . . I like seeing it on tv, as do many others, but it is causing a lot of controversy, and some publicity is bad publicity. (Im not condemning him what so ever, I love Todd Bentley, I have spent some time with him, and he is a very genuine man)

at 07:50PM 07/07/08

arealchange: could be an intercessory burden you are feeling for the body manwaring... I'll be praying for you about that. Its 11 pm and I got home from revival today with 3 hours of sleep... night everyone! I am so glad we're family!

at 07:52PM 07/07/08

masongirl: Night Sandi!

at 07:52PM 07/07/08

30something: Hmmmm....

at 07:53PM 07/07/08

arealchange: I posted this on my own post but felt led to share with you manwaring.... God told me to do a video testimonial.. I will be doing that and also writing on my blog. I saw many things.... the MOST IMPORTANT THING I saw was diversity in harmony in the presence of the glory of ALmighty God.... that is big and that is what He adores..... THAT is the target.... disrupt the harmony, disrupt the unity.... the devil is sowing division... but he won't win..... the miracles, the baptisms, the everything was like I never saw before however UNITY - THIS IS THE LAND where miracles come from, where HEAVEN INVADES EARTH.. Oh How GOOD and how pleasant it is to see brothers in unity!!!

at 07:53PM 07/07/08

aslan: Not quite sure I understand the point regarding unity..... disrupting unity, disrupting harmony....???
How...?

at 08:09PM 07/07/08

rachiebee: @ Aslan: I would say that the enemy is using this whole thing to disrupt unity through the religious spirit. Trying to divide the church and get us to lash out at one another. There are people out there saying that if you are following Todd and the revival, then you are following a demonic movement and may God have mercy on you. People are drawing very hard lines, and it's pretty disturbing, if you ask me. I mean, I guess it's typical and not surprising, but it's really sad. To see the church get so divided because their minds are so offended.

@ Manwaring: People are always going to be skeptical no matter what. Jesus couldn't even perform miracles in His hometown because of their lack of faith. I don't see this being negative. The history of revivals show that they've always been messy. There are some things going on with the revival that I question, or that rub me the wrong way, and I agree, non-believers are going to be really weirded out by some of the shaking, yelling, laughing, etc, but I don't think that this means they should change what their doing since it's on TV to make it more palatable. I know that's not what you're saying either, I'm just sharing my opinion on the whole thing.

at 09:06PM 07/07/08

manwaring: not what I was saying at all . . . I am not asking them to change what they are doing, my point is that it being on tv has negative and positive affects . . . and the church was already split, the human race did that . . .

at 09:08PM 07/07/08

rachiebee: @ manwaring: I know that's not what you were saying, I was just addressing the point you made about it turning non-christians off to all of it. And you're right, we as humans are part of the divide in the church, but the religious spirit has a lot to do with it also.

at 09:15PM 07/07/08

ladybug: great stuff guys.

since bill has been to Lakeland you should see some of the emails he is getting. Better yet, not see the emails he is getting. Wow!

This is nothing new in church history. They hated Smith Wigglesworth and the like.

I wonder all the time what people who come into our meetings that have never been what they must think. I always think and get a grin inside. Its crazy. But so God and so fun.

at 10:07PM 07/07/08

bina: well -- since u all r being honest with ur thoughts on this, i have to say that when i first watched the revival i had a sick feeling in my stomach. i couldn't put my finger on y or what because i had seen a lot of this sort of thing happening in the two churches i attend -- so it wasn't anything new to see ppl laughing or going down when whacked by the spirit. and yet there were times when he was calling out something and i would be sitting here and suddenly feel heat all over me and knew that it was God. but there was just something that made me feel uneasy other times. and everybody was so excited about it that i never wanted to tell them what i was feeling in my spirit because i was afraid that i would be put "in my place". so i kept quiet about it -- except to two friends who both know me really well. and they both said that perhaps i was sensing something that had absolutely nothing to do with Todd's ministry. about two weeks later Todd was being honest with the audience and talked about the fact that before he came to lakeland, he and his wife were having some problems. and suddenly it clicked in my heart that that was what i had been picking up on -- that uneasiness i was feeling had nothing to do with Todd's ministry -- but with his personal life. and maybe because i've been through a divorce -- like sandi says -- u pick up on stuff quicker because u've been through it. like i can tell when one of the teens is having an issue with an abusive parent, because i had one. so yeah... idk ... several ppl from both my churches have gone to lakeland (one went twice and brought back stuff to impart to the youth group and i was there and saw how it affected those kids -- so i know its real). but i understand luke's point as well. because i could see my dad having issue with it and saying that it was all demonic stuff -- and yet he's and elder in his church and studies his bible. but we've butted heads on a couple of occasions about things i've heard or been taught and he believes that he was healed of prostate issues by God but he'd never approve of the two churches i attend -- so i could see how someone who had no knowledge of what it feels like to be overcome by the Holy Spirit -- or not know the lord at all would look at what's happening there and be freaked by it -- perhaps not take it in a positive way. so i can see both sides of this issue ....

at 10:23PM 07/07/08

bina: oh and just so there's no confusion -- when Todd talked about his marital issues, he said that things were better now than they had ever been -- and i haven't felt that uneasy feeling since then -- so yeah....

at 10:50PM 07/07/08

aslan: This is not directed at anyone's comment in particular, or whatever comment this happens to follow. Placement will be by chance since this will take me a few minutes. Just some thoughts.

I would personally stop short of calling what I believe may be legitimate questions, concerns, even skepticism a "religious spirit". I would venture that EVERYONE involved in the Revival Movement (or whatever it's called) has had questions.... a time when THEY were skeptical. Now I don't believe that there are ANY excuses for the types of attacks that Bill and other leaders have to put up with. Too many Scriptures (and common sense) show those attacks to be what they are.... and that is NOT of God. Yet, to say everyone who disagrees, honestly disagrees, who questions the authenticity of "manifestations" or healings or teachings, has a religious spirit..... well I think that can be just as divisive and damaging. We need not deny there are excesses,,,,, because there are. That shows there are people involved. But....... the authenticity of what God does is demonstrated IN those people who have been touched........ and I believe that one of the ways this is shown is how we respond to criticism. I'm not sure that attacking, accusing those who might have honest concerns/issues of being Pharisees and being ruled by a religious spirit, is any different than what's being directed at the movement itself. Just some thoughts.

at 11:03PM 07/07/08

eleedy: Very well spoken, as always, Aslan. I couldn't agree with you more, just caught up on this thread, really good discussion, my one thought was just that, that we all have had those questions and concerns, even with our own faiths. I know that for me, I was raised in a Christian home, went to Christian school and so on, I had to "question" the Bible and God's reality in my life before it was "real" to me, and MY decision. If you blindly follow without truly believing than you are not really going to get what God has for you. So, it's ok to have some questions, as long as they lead to Him, and you do nothing to damage others in the process of your own acceptance of Him and His movement.

at 11:20PM 07/07/08

zacb: last night was great

at 05:41AM 07/08/08

rachiebee: @ Aslan: Even though you said it wasn't directed at anyone, since i mentioned a lot about the "religious spirit", I wanted to comment a little more! :o) I totally agree with you 100%. There is nothing wrong with questions, and I have noticed that it's been easy for some friends of mine to automatically call out the religious spirit when anyone questions something. I mean, in all reality, I have questions myself sometimes. I find myself spending hours with my dad just discussing some of the particular things going on there. But of course, as others have already said, the place where it's getting out of hand is people are condemning and lashing out at anyone following the revival. We actually lost one of our members at our church because he was so offended that we all believed this was a move of God. He just left and said he wanted nothing to do with our ministry anymore. He he pointed out all of the spliced YouTube videos about Angels, etc, and how Todd was obviously being influenced by a demon. We addressed the things he brought up, but his mind was already made. It has been really sad to see that.

If we just expect people to watch the revival and "get it," we are mistaken. As followers in Christ, we have to be here to help each other when we have questions, because rejecting someone for their skepticism is just as divisive. So, we have to do our part! Honestly seek out real biblical answers to people's questions.

Oh and one other thing, I do really appreciate that Todd has addressed most of the accusations made about him to straighten things out. Whether it helps or not, I'm not sure, but I'm glad he's being realistic enough to understand that there is some confusion out there about his ministry.

at 06:32AM 07/08/08

arealchange: I think the reason I am SO PASSIONATE about coming against the religious spirit is because it nearly cost me my life. NO SPIRIT on the face of the earth stirred up "I am not good enough I should just commit suicide" than that spirit.. it was that spirit that caused me to doubt the gift of prophesy, lay aside the gift of tongues, settle in complacency, say that the wisdom and discernment I have might just be a female hormonal thing and all I can say is I was sick for 7 years after that... cancer, lupus, RA, depression, confusion, you name it....and I don't believe that was something God Himself wants to tolerate, nestle in with, give people the benefit of the doubt that tis just their opinion. That was a spirit from hell sent from hell to speak death over me personally to disable the call and destiny that God had for me... so when fire from heaven came thru the Toronto Revival my way it's no small wonder that the cancer ceased, the bones went back in place, the bleeding in my gut stopped, the depression ran, the suicide died and life came alive and the tongues came back, the prophesy came back, the wisdom grew forward, the discernment called forth and said this ain't no hormonal twist this is a gift of God and He will not be silent. I had a religious uprising on my hand because God thought He'd be funny and heal me while I was in a religious church with my head covered and my skirts on and the unbelieving leadership saying miracles aren't for today. God Himself thought He'd be fun and throw that my way because He wanted to stir the waters and tell the devil to cease and desist. Whoosh.. wow

at 06:38AM 07/08/08

arealchange: Rachiebee the spirit of offense, hurt feelings, feeling rejected is the fuel behind all division and honestly I have never EVER EVER met anyone who hurls accusations that are damaging who isn't offended in some way. They might have it deep down and not want to admit it but it's there.

at 06:41AM 07/08/08

arealchange: I didn't get to watch all of this live last night... Todd has really answered alot for me... my gift of faith is what makes me black and white, no grey. The gift of faith is what has gotten me into trouble if I don't have grace... so as I talk about a religious spirit please know I am not thinking of a human or a person my gift of discernment and faith makes it black and white for me. Sometimes it's extremely distressing because people think I am thinking about someone....... when God healed me of all this..... that faith came back.... it was that gift of faith that was attacked so harshly..... my stewarding after being in Lakeland is to WALK in that gift of faith to have an offenseless heart, to not let someone else's lack of faith make me feel like I have to defend mine.... time to get to work for me! I have 4 days of work to catch up on !!! Blessings everyone!!!! :)

at 06:50AM 07/08/08

ladybug: i missed the last three comments but will pick up on Jm's stuff.

When Bill and the crew with to Lakeland there were those who had concerns. The good thing is that they wanted to talk with Todd and ask real questions. I like that. Know problem with that.

at 07:23AM 07/08/08

ladybug: one more point. I have watched my husband purposely not explain things that are happening in a meeting, crazy stuff. He doesn't feel the need to always explain the move of God.
I think Jesus did that a few times.

at 07:27AM 07/08/08

bina: i worry sometimes because of the way some ppl take the "questions" i have (that anyone might have). where am i being placed -- how am i being perceived. but a friend said to me that "having honest questions that come of a right heart and a desire to follow holy spirit isn't wrong" (this was in regard to something that happened in our church recently -- not ospecifically to Todd's revival). it gave me comfort to know that i could question and get answers and not be looked at as someone with a "religius spirit" out to knock down someone or their ministry. that was never my intent with the feelings i had about what was happening in lakeland -- and sure enough -- i got my answer a few weeks later. but had i not talked to my two friends and have them tell me that i might be picking up on something that had nothing to do with the ministry -- what might i have thought -- because they talked to me i could be patient and wait for daddy God to show me what it was i was feeling and y. how many ppl r there like me who felt that, questioned what they were feeling, didn't realize it was not specifically about the ministry, but were rebuffed (perhaps unintentionally) by someone as being against what Todd was doing. i think questions r good when done with a right heart and a desire to follow Holy Spirit. and i would hope that when someone asks questions, that we can give them the benefit of the doubt and answer the questions honestly or pray with them for guidance from Holy Spirit on the issues they r struggling with. and i'm not just talking about what's happening in Lakeland, but in any area -- how else will ppl learn the truth and grow in their faith.

at 07:38AM 07/08/08

arleta: @bina Thanks for sharing some of these issues. If Lakeland had been happening 2 yrs ago, I know I would have had some struggles with it due to great concerns over family involved in new age and "watching" for anything that could lead a Christian astray. My position came from love & genuine concern, but was based on fear. If I didn't know the character of the Johnson's, I may have had a few worries. Now, I am less likely to react quickly over some "concern", but more likely to take it to God & ask Him to show me through His Word, the Holy Spirit & some research what is true. Occasionally I watch Todd & think "oh, why'd he do that or say that, someone's going to have trouble with it", but I always sense the Spirit and more recently I've been thinking that this may be someone my son would listen too. I have no more fear, just hope that soon my son will hear the call of God on his life. Also, even though Todd isn't generally accepted in my area (Pac. N.W.), I have noticed that it's opening doors of conversation that just weren't there before to discus how we (many Christians in my area) have shut the door to the Holy Spirit because of fear of man or so no one would be uncomfortable. Now, we're just wondering why our churches seem "dead" spiritually.
@aslan Thank you for your words, too. I am a sensitive person, by nature & try to be polite with others even if we disagree. I know that for myself when I am concerned about an issue I do want to clarify those concerns and it may be that I need to ask questions of someone, but it shouldn't be assumed that I'm questioning their character.

at 11:02AM 07/08/08

suem: I think its great that we can all share where we are at with Lakeland or any other spiritual topic and still love one another and find help where we have questions. We all come from different backgrounds/situations and will often "view" things like Lakeland from that grid that we have. sometimes that is helpful and sometimes not, I am learning to not straight away go to my past and view from there but to go to God and see it from HIs perspective and see His heart on it and to trust the men and women in my life that are Fathers and Mothers to me and who are my covering because sometimes I still cant see clearly and I value their direction whilst still being free to have opinions !!

at 11:11AM 07/08/08

suem: That posted at 11.11 which is a number I see constantly, that and others but mainly 11.11 for the last few years. !!

at 11:13AM 07/08/08

guvnor15: LoL....shiFt haPPenS and SCHisMs FoLLoW..within the body and withiN ourSelveS

at 12:59PM 07/08/08

aslan: @guvnor15 Hmmmmm I'm not sure I understand....?

at 01:03PM 07/08/08

guvnor15: i will send u message directly asian since the question you have asked is directed to me and the statement i made wasnt directed to anyone in particular

at 01:12PM 07/08/08

ericag: I was not raised in a Christian home. But, when I encoutnered God I did not care what it looked like I wanted it. The hungry will always search out truth. YEAH for Todd, YEAH for someone who is desperate for the presence of God, YEAH for God for honoring a man with His presence. I want to honor God and honor His friends. YEAH that God lets us be His friends.

at 01:22PM 07/08/08

30something: It's true. I think that Christians are way more concerned with how we look or how God looks to the "world" than they are. They have no grid for how He's "supposed" to look, so why would they care. What the world can't stand is religion. Religion is a lot of talk and rules with no grace. That's what we should be wary of displaying to the world. In my opinion ;)

at 02:02PM 07/08/08

aslan: @guvnor15 Thanks for the explanation. I DO agree that division, in itself, isn't necessarily a bad thing..... "if" it comes from a move of God.

@readers, in general I suppose my comments are a concern that people who embrace a new move of God "sometimes" reject those who have a "honest" reservations or concerns. We don't have to talk them into anything.... I'm not sure that is even possible. But... we ARE called, I believe, to give Grace, as 30something has described it, as we, ourselves, have been given Grace. In "my" comments, I am specifically referring to fellow believers, members of the Body of Christ, who have hesitancies, as many who have commented above have described themselves as having at times. I DO agree that we don't have to, nor should we, try to make God "look good", but I do believe that we should show forbearance to fellow believers as GOD works in their lives, as He has worked in our own. Honest seekers WILL have their desires fulfilled.... in my opinion.

at 02:43PM 07/08/08

jacque: O my this is so good!!!!!!!I mean good!!!!
luv ya so much Jim!

at 06:40PM 07/08/08

arealchange: this is really REALLY good !!!! If I saw this 4 years ago I would not have been on 'this side' but I already stated that in my video I did last week ( teehee).... sadly I called Toronto of the devil myself... and God had mercy on me, sent the fire my way, healed me and said, "So now do you believe?" WOW what an amazing wonderful God we serve :) And Beni God didn't need to explain anything to me once I encountered it myself.... there was no refuting what I experienced... my gnosis became epikignosis (spell) and that was enough!

at 06:50PM 07/08/08

manwaring: @ aslan, perfectly put.

at 07:02PM 07/08/08

ransomedone: @SueM-YES and AMEN! I love what you said!

at 07:07PM 07/08/08

suem: thanks ransomedone !!

at 07:16PM 07/08/08

jacque: I would love to sit in a corner and listen to Paul and Jim talk......

at 07:27AM 07/09/08

peggy: Questions are good, just like when children ask questions, not always comfortable, but usually neccessary. Sometimes like someone said earlier, you might be decerning something is off and you dont know what it is, we need to be able to bounce thngs off one another.

at 07:21PM 07/09/08

maryj: I see Nightline is doing a show on Todd Bently tonight.. just thought I would pass it along if you were interested

at 10:47PM 07/09/08

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